Lemmy could really do with the ability to transfer an account to a new instance. The only reason I’m still on lemmy.world is because I can’t be bothered to set up an account on another instance that may be as insufferable.
As for communities, Lemmy just isn’t large enough to be picky. World is the biggest instance, but is still dead on anything that’s not either a Reddit clone or a popular community.
There is an export feature that will spit out a json file and you can import it to a new instance. It will carry over your subbed communities and blocked accounts. I use it to sync accounts on different instances (My instance can be slow sometimes)
I love .ml and it’s where I go when I’m in the right mood. Maybe it’s not for everyone, but I say meet .ml halfway.
Right you are, I am almost complete opposite end of political compass from .ml but still end up having interesting discussions and finding commonalities. To me .world is where the echo chamber dwelling momos live.
Normalise criticizing both the West and China/Russia for their shit.
Don’t make it your identity to defend horrible shit, anywhere.
Past or Present
Banned.
This, but unironically is ml experience
Confirmed! I was banned last week from the privacy ml sub for commenting
something along the lines offound exact comment from modlog which states ban was for violating rule 2 = “Be respectful” (i.e. anything the mods disagree with).Nothing. OP is a tankie / Russian PsyOps operative. If you care about a Russian billionaire who’s surveillance capitalism platform refuses to even acknowledge requests to remove criminals, you deserve to live under the boot of Russia’s authoritarian Kleptocracy. Save your energy for the **_actual_** wars on encryption and privacy that western plutocrats and capitalism are waging under the lie of Freedom™️.
I would argue the tankie instances/subs/users are actually Russian operatives, instead of CCP — same as it always is/was on Reddit.
Literally
Normalise criticizing both the West and China/Russia
But you still have to admit that the West is better. Otherwise you’re doing a Whataboutism
If the discussion is good, what is the problem? Genuine question.
Lemmy.ml is run by people who spread authoritarian propaganda, most likely the CCP. It’s a real stain on Lemmy and people shouldn’t support or legitimize it in any way.
most likely the CCP
Yeah you’re gonna need a source for that one. I don’t like ml but you can’t just throw that out there without evidence
Seriously, that’s buck wild. I hope they meant “they support the CCP”, which isn’t a stretch given the various Soviet-era iconography in the profiles of its maintainers (Mao, Castro, Gagarin, etc.), and not “they’re acting on behalf of the CCP”, which is such a ridiculous claim to make with no further substantiation.
Agreed. Many definitely support it
What kind of source can I offer? Photocopies of internal CCP propaganda documents? This isn’t the kind of thing you can link to a research journal to prove.
The CCP has always relied heavily on propaganda, and is obviously investing on it internationally with things like Tik Tok.
The Fediverse is an easy, easy target. They run their own instance and set their own rules, and there’s absolutely no budget and basically no coordination whatsoever to counter disinformation.
It’s an easy target but also a near worthless one. What does the CCP gain from getting a bunch of terminally online Linux nerds on their side? No one making real decisions that could effect China is on here.
4chan is also a soft target but you don’t see parties or governments investing in propagandizing there because it’s full of basement dwelling incels who can’t do anything besides maybe shoot up a school.
there are almost certainly people propagandizing on chans, especially 4chans /pol/ as it has a fairly large user base and has proven to be very influential with dozens (or more) of academic papers written about its culture and dynamics.
https://firstmonday.org/ojs/index.php/fm/article/download/11075/11269/83226 this paper shows trends in pol posting surrounding major news events (mass shootings). Specifically after the Pittsburgh shooting they see a significant change of a small number of pro trump links circulated hundreds of times immediately in the aftermath, more so than before the incident. There are similar papers and many more describing the culture to help potential actors assimilate as quickly as possible
Again, the causal nature is impossible to prove (unless Hiroyuki starts leaking ips and they can be linked to someone somehow, I guess), but it appears someone(s) has been using that forum to make a concentrated effort to promote certain ideas, mainly pro trump propaganda and antisemitism.
Based on estimates 4chan gets anywhere from 20-60 million visitors per month. /pol/ alone sees well over 100-120k posts per day right now per 4stats.io, 4chans official stats. It’s by far one of the most active boards, running about the same as /vg/, dedicated to general gaming, and also full of bullshit but the whiny gamer kind (which is a well established pipeline to places like /pol/). whereas core 4chan boards like /b/ (random, the original board, where kind of anything goes), and /a/ (anime, probably the earliest board once it split from just /b/ for everything) being the next most active see barely half this, 40-50k posts per day.
Basically /pol/ sees a massive amount of discussion from a giant group of angry impressionable (often young but not always) people who are absolutely willing to campaign, make and spread memes, flood comment sections, etc. you’re foolish if you think that’s not being astroturfed and botted by people with vested interests. like is the trump campaign directly doing it? Probably not, but is one of their pacs kicking some money to some stormfront dudes who are? Maybe. It could also potentially be some weird trump group that spams and is otherwise unaffiliated with the campaign of course. That’s still propaganda, it’s just not sanctioned “officially”.
And this was touched on but the /pol/ influence is seen throughout the boards as well. They’ll spout their talking points on the videogame boards as mentioned like /v/, /vg/, etc to pull in gullible people but also the anime board (/a/), even slow boards like do it yourself (/diy/) which sees like 400 posts a day will get posts about immigration impacting trade jobs as a way to shoehorn in the typical rhetoric
In comparison according to fedidb lemmy has a bit under 400k users (a bit over 1/10th active, around 45k) and a bit over 8 million posts. That’s a footnote compared to 4chan which itself is dwarfed by the giants like reddit, facebook, etc that see monthly visitor counts in the billions. Of the fediverse mastodon would make the most sense to astroturf as it has significantly more users and posts. Unless they see serious growth potential and want to establish trust early on the platform, which would make sense I suppose, but looking at lemmys growth charted out that could be a very long wait for a return on investment. While posting is free paying people/bots to post isn’t. But perhaps they’re hoping it will become like /pol/, a niche forum on the internet that has decent enough traffic to become surprisingly influential. I do think this is unlikely, but who the fuck am I?
Of course, the statistics are not fully accurate here for either. 4chans traffic is estimated and sources vary pretty wildly, 4chans post counts should be accurate as that does come from 4chan. fedidb info is accurate but iirc doesn’t necessarily include all instances. That said it’s unlikely there’s an a few instances that would wildly skew the data and most estimates for 4chans traffic are on the higher end of 40-50 million visitors per month
I sincerely doubt that a covert arm of the Chinese propaganda machine would label themselves as Marxist-Leninist.
They stoke extremist political views in their “enemies” societies while also spreading propaganda. Its a facade
Why not? Socialism and Anarchy are both very popular among the fringe groups and youth demographics they’re trying to persuade into subterfuge. They’re also targeting LGBT.
Go over to Hexbear or Lemmygrad and you can clearly see tons of pro-China and pro-Russia (more specifically Pro-Jinping and Pro-Putin) posts all hours of the day, and all of it is constantly flooding into the instances that federate with them.
Yeah, it’s honestly been really disappointing to me to see the general apathy towards all the propaganda on here
I’d love to recommend the fediverse to friends, the idea is incredible
Spend some time browsing through the instances communities.
It is well known that that both the main devs of Lemmy (whose home instance is Lemmy.ml) are
communistssocialists who side with the ideals of China (CCP). Also, it may be less known that the .ml is short for Marxist/Leninist or Marx/Lenin. Either way, it’s a hat tip tocommunismsocialism.They are known for being heavy-handed with post/comment removal and bans of opposing views of any kind. Viewing their mod log would attest to that.
That’s is a lot of words to hand wave away a reasonable expectation as you say “do your own research.”
Stated without evidence dismissed without evidence, etc.
It’s really easy to demonstrate. Ask them for an alternative to Harris/Trump and they’ll run around in circles to not give you a candidate and then tell you voting doesn’t work.
A lot of people genuinely feel that way even if I think they’re wrong and it’s unproductive
I’d like to apologize that you felt my response was dismissive. I certainly did not intend to make anybody feel that way. I didn’t have any specific examples to give, so I approached it from an anecdotal point of view based on my personal experiences.
I appreciate that and I could definitely do with less snark in my comments. That being said accusing the CCP of astroturfing lemmy instance at scale is a serious claim and it needs real evidence.
Minor correction: tankies aren’t communists.
Now that you mention it, I just realized I meant socialism and not communism. Thank you.
They aren’t socialists either. Socialists want workers to own the means of production. MLs want the state to control the means of production. The two are inherently incompatible.
Lol “You can just tell”
Using Lemmy in general pretty much is legitimizing lemmy.ml’s admin work though…
The thing about open source software, no one person gets the credit for it. Especially since the Reddit exodus there have been more and more contributors.
Those same people are also the lead developers of lemmy.
Exhibit A of the original dev’s moderation style
Fuck that guy, best thing he did was make Lemmy open source so it can grow beyond their tiny little world view
Lol, you go and shit in someone’s house and then get upset that they kicked you out.
It’s not a good discussion when they ban you in the middle of it for saying NATO is a defensive alliance.
That is a shock? In my experience political and news communities are always biased and will remove anything that isn’t a part of the narrative. Some are worse than others but the desire to stop “misinformation” often leads to censorship.
Its fair game because my comment got removed on lemmy.world for criticizing Israel.
Sounds like a challenge!
NATO is a defensive alliance and the Israeli government is filled with war criminals who need to be thrown in the Hauge
Edit: To the instance-blocked guy who replied that “Thrown in the Hauge” has a weird energy:
Fine, I missed a capital letter. But also: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hague_Penitentiary_Institution
I said worse things about USSR history and I still comment on political LM posts when I feel like putting effort, and don’t even care about the instance if the subject is neutral. Their users did appreciate deeper digs in what it really was if I could produce some insights. The only user\mod I had problems with is y-tos, and I choose not to touch anything they write at all.
i feel like .ml is kind of hit or miss, some of the people on it are fine, some are just assholes, and some are just straight tankies. It’s a weird mix going on over there.
That was the default Lemmy instance for a very long time, so I guess for pre-reddit exodus folks it wasn’t more of a choice than for lemmy.world users now.
that would make sense in some aspects. Gotta love decentralized communities.
lol Based
Because the discussion isn’t good, the instance admins themselves go from thread to thread removing anything that doesn’t agree with their chosen narrative of the week(subject to change according to the latest ccp talking points)
Because the discussion isn’t good…
Bro first line in the meme says “you see an amazing discussion”
Yeah, but then you see that the discussion is doomed because of where it’s happening.
Sometimes it isn’t bad. For instance the privacy community is generally pretty good. However, there are some mods who have a “different” way of seeing things. They want the communities they mod to be propaganda machines.
I used to get annoyed but now I just move on to different communities. I will say that the admins of Lemmy.ml have gotten a lot more reasonable. They are still politically far left but they don’t force there views nearly as much. Its some of the mods that are the problem. I don’t care what they believe in but you shouldn’t remove something because it challenges your beliefs
They’re not far left. They’re China/Russia shills. Authoritarianism isn’t far left.
Authoritarianism can be left or right
Some people get really bent out of shape that not every instance is exactly the same as lemmy.world, cheer-leading for the exact same worldview. They are intellectually brittle and emotionally weak, so when they don’t see the same group-think taking over somewhere they can’t control they need to post something like “BUT WE ALL HATE THEM OVER THERE, RIGHT FELLAS?! WE GOOD, THEM BAD! LET’S DE-FEDERATE!”
World has its own problems. The rampant use of slurs/general ableism is unbelievable. If you say a word about it they shout you down with more vile slurs/insults.
… Such as?
Are you asking what terms they use?
Correct. I’ve been here for just a month, but so far I haven’t seen a single slur that’s ableist, homophobic, transphobic, racist, or xenophobic.
I see variations of the r-word several times a week. A lot of c-word too whenever women come up.
Yes! Communism is rampant on there! Not that I’m against it, but they will mass downvote anyone who asks a question that’s against their views. Anyone else?
Isn’t that the basic political community/subreddit experience? If you go to truth social, I don’t think you’re gonna get many likes
Echo chambers, hmmmm
What’s a better way to make our little community bigger and better that having pesky antagonisms over every little difference we can find.
We better centralize over a single instance of people thinking exactly like we do.
Big /S by the way.
And I’m not even from .ml but come’on, we share more than we disagree on.
The .ml instance has deliberately overt bias and will literally ban you for not agreeing with their interpretation of Marxist-Leninist communism.
Bad faith “conversation” is their thing.
Many of their communities are becoming “the Donald” type situations.
You choose to socialize and mingle with who you want
I fully expect the MAGA mentality is fully transferable to any other far-left ideological group with a purity doctrine that is exclusive and abusive to outsiders.
This mentality is actually ideologically agnostic and will ride any wave it can to feed the emotional needs of the adherent.
How is that different from say news on .world?
They both ban on ideology.
The .ml instance has deliberately overt bias
My guy, you’re posting in a thread that’s just Overt Bias + Meme. I don’t think anyone here has room to talk
This is a meme.
I also don’t see anyone running around spouting misinformation here and deliberately misinterpreting history.
I also don’t see anyone get banned for their opinions here.
I got banned from a .ml meme/comic sub the other day for knowing more about world history than they did.
For calling the outright misinformation what it was and just generally not agreeing with them
Many .ml communities are becoming (or already are) their own little the_donald type communities.
ML is run by tankies, who historically infiltrate, corrupt, and eliminate anarchist projects with anti-socialist, anti-communist, and hierarchical methods and motivations. MLs are to Anarchists as a tapeworm is to a cow.
Edit: stay mad, tankies.
I disagree.
I’ve worked in actual political projects in the streets. And I haven’t found that.
You can be forever reading online why some people are the evil incarnated. But when you met and work with people for a common goal reality tend to be better.
Judging without truly knowing is one of the things we all should be striving to avoid. There are wonderful people everywhere.
I would recommend yo actually go participate in some common local political protects of you can find some. For me it was eye opening to see that despite one or two things we have common goals, objectives and very likewise minds.
I also refuse to participate in the endless split of the leftist space, and the never ending false divisions that only weaken us. So for a long time I’ve refused to identify with any particular leftist group. I am just for the common benefit of humandkind and will welcome anyone with the same goal.
I don’t know why you are using in person community praxis as a refutation of an online space being toxic
Real life isn’t online, the issue is an online space being shitty
I don’t find .ml specially toxic or shitty. I certainly hasn’t been called “asshole” by any .ml user or in any .ml space recently. Couldn’t say the same for other instances… There are wonderful people everywhere, and sadly bad people everywhere too. As far as .ml .world or any other of these big instances I don’t appreciate any more toxicity in one place or other.
You’re assuming a lot about me, typical of tankie apologia. You assert these things without evidence defying my own experience and the wisdom of history. Why should anyone trust you, and even if you’re not making it up, why should we ignore the weight of evidence that lies beyond your anecdotes?
You do you. I refuse to keep weakening our common political space for nothing. Because that’s what we’ll get if we keep dividing. Nothing.
You sound like an appeaser. If you want an imperfect ally, I recommend liberals. Less dishonest and not as likely to round you up in the middle of the night and put a bullet in your head. Liberals are also more numerous than tankies, less indoctrinated, and not usually as politically aware which makes them easier to educate. There’s no reason to side with tankies over liberals. Tankies also famously divide the left from liberals, probably because they realize if Anarchists can unite against their common enemy with liberals the tankies can’t leverage power away from the Anarchists.
Tankies aren’t even leftists, so don’t pretend that their spaces are leftist spaces.
Got any more names to call me? I’ve already got called tankie apologist, appeaser, anything else?. You have lots of names for those who think different than you. Also lots of hate, sorry for that.
You choose your allies. But don’t deny people working for the betterment of the working clase the name of leftists, please.
Edit: I just realized that by liberals you probably mean American liberals, democratic party and such?, not economic liberals? It can be confusing from people elsewhere. Anyway, american “liberals” let’s say the democratic party is cool in my book. Afaik also working for the betterment of their people. But not American so people over there may have a better understanding of those. Where I live the equivalent would probably be the socdems, which are of course allies of mine.
I feel no need to side between (american)liberals and communists. If some of those refuse each other it is their problem, I would consider both part of the left spectrum and be willing to work with each.
names to call me
I said what you sounded like and what your rhetoric was typical of, I didn’t call you any names. Here’s an actual name for you in particular: You are an asshole. You tried to call me out, assumed things of me that weren’t true, and now you’re pretending that I’m treating you unreasonably. Fuck all the way off.
And unfortunately lemmy.ml is getting more online traffic recently.
Is it? It looks pretty stable to me. Conversely, world, lemm.ee and shitjustworks are all experiencing slight but noticeable growth.
I see this as an absolute win! The point of decentralized social media is that discussion happens across many different linked sites. It doesn’t work if lemmy.world is the only big site out there.
Sure have your beef with the admins of another server, but why get upset that discussions are happening there?
It’s only really a problem when comments get removed or people get banned because they have opposing views.
Bans are fine IMO, I don’t want tankie shit clogging up my feed. I should be able to block those views and the admin should be allowed to block them from participating if they so choose.
Its about tankies banning non tankies.
It’s different when our side does it
i realize the joke. BUT, tankies are generally pretty insufferable. Normies, don’t really happen to be all that insufferable, unless you’re a tankie who believes anything other than what you think is fucking extremist terrorist shit.
thats the point of instances, but idk why they show up in .ml or world in that case lol. You would think tankies would just directly echo chamber themselves, but they haven’t quite done that yet.
So are non tankies. Tankies don’t have a monopoly on being closed minded, being jerks, etc. lemmy.world is really bringing out the misanthropy in me today, for example.
Edit: Ugh, was just reminded about some of the things the tankies are saying. There’s no comparison.
classic tankie experience “surely the tankies aren’t SO bad” “oh”
Pro palestinian comments get removed on lemmy.world. Some people have the same argument as you but about diametrically opposing idealogy
I have not had a single Pro-Palestinian comment get removed from world, and I’ve had some pretty confrontational conversations in support of Palestinians.
That’s been my experience as well
Have an example? It should be in the modlog.
As the top comment points out, they banned Linkerbaan. You could argue it was a public service.
I don’t agree with that user on most of the stuff but when it comes to israel you guys make them look like a normal person.
It’s important that one group of people should not be able to monopolize the discussion. I believe it’s important to the long-term health of the fediverse even if I don’t agree with some of those groups.
I agree there, but only if both sides of an argument are arguing in good faith. A lot of chucklenuts out there just want to start shit with bullshit arguments or to simply be contrarian. If one side is rational and using actual evidence while the other is blatantly pulling shit from their ass, that’s not good for anything.
lemmy.world users when lemmy.ml user don’t immediately suck up to political propaganda
There’s a reason why having both world news communities from both instances is a good thing. You’ll receive a much wider range of sources and bias, as well as the perspective of people who don’t completely agree with you.
Staying within on instance community creates an echo chamber like reddit. There’s even such a wild difference within lemmy.world between c/Politics and c/News, despite them often posting similar news and info.
You’ll receive a much wider range of sources and bias, as well as the perspective of people who don’t completely agree with you.
That’s why I often interact with Truth Social /s
Since blocking .ml, I’ve not accidentally contributed to things there. As a result, I haven’t had any hate in my inbox since. Just nice, respectful interactions and discussions.
Ooooh I’m about to stuff that inbox FULL of hate!
I genuinely have no idea what this is. I just came here for the cat memes. There are very few cat memes here.
Be the change you want to see in the world!
Recently changed from Lemmy.today to Lemmy.world because all the CCP communities like Hexbear blocked me so I can’t downvote and tell them off for promoting actual propaganda and misinformation. That’s pretty much half the feed now uninteractable so I figured I might as well stop seeing them.
Hexbear doesn’t even have down votes, you were doing nothing
I can influence the feeds they show up in by downvoting.
I’m subbed to a handful of communities in .ml and it’s not that bad. I consider myself communist, but not of the tankie flavor. Authoritarianism is never a good thing.
If people don’t like those views, they shouldn’t wade in unless they’re willing to have a grounded conversation and not just drop a played out one-liner. I think the most recent uptick in complaints about .ml are because of how often it criticizes liberalism.
Lemmy instances are essentially forums. If I go to a conservative community and tell them all that Marx was right all along, I’m not gonna be surprised when I get banned. Complaining about mods is a tale as old as time itself.
They literally censor comments even in non political Communities.
Lemmy.ml is just a Propaganda-Machine.
Try saying anything negative of Putin/Russia (apparently also China/Xi) and you’ll see how pro-authoritarian and heavily censored their threads are. I know because that’s what got me banned from the privacy ml sub last week!
Edit: found exact comment from modlog which states ban was for violating rule 2 = “Be respectful” (i.e. anything the mods disagree with).
Nothing. OP is a tankie / Russian PsyOps operative. If you care about a Russian billionaire who’s surveillance capitalism platform refuses to even acknowledge requests to remove criminals, you deserve to live under the boot of Russia’s authoritarian Kleptocracy. Save your energy for the **_actual_** wars on encryption and privacy that western plutocrats and capitalism are waging under the lie of Freedom™️.
Yeah lets ban discussion too eh.
That’s how I see .ml because you have to be in the cult and not question anything or get banned.
-
Angry because you don’t want to see content from Lemmy.ml
-
Angry because they don’t want to see your content either
:-/
Didn’t say that, like at all.
-
I got banned there for stating an opinion and at that point I don’t really know what to do anymore. You have a handful of people who spout their one sided talking points into the void (probably) and if anyone says anything, they get banned.
They can have their bubble there but aren’t bubbles the fundamental problem of social media?
So they do nothing about broader and fundamental problems of social media which they should do as alternative social media platform.
Or midwest.social, which for some reason I can’t comment or vote on.
Your mistake is not having lemmy.ml blocked
How? I keep seeing hexbear comments even though I blocked the entire instance
